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7th July, 2008
11:49 am

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Pride and Prejudice
As those who've seen [info]the_local_echo's photo post will know, myself, her, [info]zoeimogen and [info]julieisfree marched in the Pride London parade on Saturday. Since Zoe had two of her kids with her and needed to leave early, and Sylvia and I had been up since 6am to meet Julie at Gatwick, we elected not to stick around for the rally. Instead, Julie, Sylvia and I met up with [info]swordpanda, who I hadn't seen in ages (and who is looking really good) and wandered over to Chinatown for lunch in a rather chaotically run Chinese buffet.

This meant that we weren't around to witness the incident which seems to be becoming known as "toiletgate", where [info]rozk was refused entry to the loos by a steward, because apparently a woman had recently been attacked by a man in them, or something. To make matters worse, the steward was backed up by an off duty Metropolitan Police LBGT liaison officer who suggested that transwomen should carry and be prepared to show a gender recognition certificate if we expected to be able to use public toilets.

The scapegoating of transwomen for male sexual violence against women is deeply offensive, and the creeping use of the Gender Recognition Act, a piece of legislation designed to reduce discrimination against transpeople, to discriminate against us is deeply worrying. That this happened at Pride of all places beggars belief!

Anyway, setting up the front page of www.transatpride.org to detail this incident seemed to be the least I could do, and in the last 24 hours it's received more hits than it did in May and June combined, from sites all around the planet. Toiletgate is going global! I also sent feedbak to the Metropolitan Police expresing my dismay at the issues and pointing them to the account on transatpride.org. This morning I received the following response by email:

Sarah

We are aware and that officer has got it completely wrong, as you know.

Our Diversity and Citizen Focus Directorate is now looking into the matter and has already advised all LGBT LO officers as to what the correct response should have been.

I understand that the officer concerned was off duty and not part of our operation, nevertheless if he is an MPS member we will address it.

I apologise if it in anyway spoilt your day.

...which is at least reassuring. I sent a mail back expressing my gratitude for the response. Let's hope that there is at least some good to come out of this unpleasant incident. I can't imagine how humiliating the experience must have been for Roz.

Edit: I just received the following response to my reply.

I have just spoken to the DCFD officer who is looking into this and all may not be what it seems.

The LO officer has given an account that differs from the one being circulated. That officer is very experienced and well respected. The investigating officer is looking at CCTV and the other persons who were there for their accounts.
Once we know what that reveals the MPS will be making a statement to trans groups etc.

I will make sure you get a copy of that statement.

Looks like this has some way to run yet.

(Leave a comment)

Comments
 
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From:[info]alicephilippa
Date:7th July, 2008 11:09 am (UTC)
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The same response that I received, not that I expected a personal response.

Let us hope that the officer concerned receives an appropriate kick up the backside.

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From:[info]asknosecrets
Date:7th July, 2008 11:10 am (UTC)
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At least they wrote back - hopefully it's not just placating, and the wanker involved will be taken to the carpet.
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From:[info]purplegril
Date:7th July, 2008 11:11 am (UTC)
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Wah. I had no idea it was pride and would love to have gone. I should probably get on a mailing list or something...
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From:[info]zoeimogen
Date:7th July, 2008 11:19 am (UTC)
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OK, some random tranny we've never heard of and I could understand that things might be subject to interpretation.

But this was [info]rozk. I don't buy it.
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From:[info]alicephilippa
Date:7th July, 2008 11:22 am (UTC)
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Something smells big time, and it's not Roz's version of events.
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From:[info]auntysarah
Date:7th July, 2008 11:30 am (UTC)
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Her CV is impressive. The officer responsible would do well to stop digging.
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From:[info]zoeimogen
Date:7th July, 2008 11:31 am (UTC)
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My guess is that if it's an off-duty officers word against Roz's word, they'll believe the off-duty officer as they don't realise quite how well-respected she is.

That would be stupid, and would cross into IPCC territory fairly quick I would guess. It might be worth getting others who were there for the protest bit to write their experiences of it too.
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From:[info]snakey
Date:7th July, 2008 05:26 pm (UTC)
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For a moment there I thought you meant the International Panel on Climate Change. Then I caught on. *headdesk*
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From:[info]foibey
Date:7th July, 2008 04:33 pm (UTC)
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Consider the number of random trannies whose versions don't get taken seriously because an officer with the met has enough sense of career-preservation to just pretend it all happened differently once it comes to complaints...
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From:[info]zoeimogen
Date:7th July, 2008 09:39 pm (UTC)
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Indeed, it's almost worth not saying anything about her background and see what they do - then come out with exactly what you just said to them.
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From:[info]zoefruitcake
Date:7th July, 2008 11:27 am (UTC)
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I bet a lot of people have regrets about that
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From:[info]julieisfree
Date:7th July, 2008 11:33 am (UTC)

Strategy

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The LO officer has given an account that differs from the one being circulated. That officer is very experienced and well respected.

Though sometimes it is difficult, perhaps a prudent course of action is to give the DCFD an opportunity to save face in some form or fashion, while the trans community gets what it needs: Respect and further refinement of the DCFD sensitivity training. Saving face does not imply however, the trans people involved should in any way admit error or guilt, but rather acknowledge that "perhaps" there was a missunderstanding that resulted from the actions and statement of the steward involved.
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From:[info]cmcmck
Date:7th July, 2008 11:54 am (UTC)

Re: Strategy

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What really disturbs me here is that I'll take a bet that as a straight, married (ie privileged) transwoman accompanied by my husband, they wouldn't have given me a second look if I'd headed for the ladies.

I suspect that there are more inwardnesses and phobic behaviour here than the most obvious.

Please give me a call today, Julie? We still need to sort out meeting up tomorrow :o)
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From:[info]the_local_echo
Date:7th July, 2008 01:44 pm (UTC)
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What really disturbs me here is that I'll take a bet that as a straight, married (ie privileged) transwoman accompanied by my husband, they wouldn't have given me a second look if I'd headed for the ladies.

As long as your husband wasn't accompanying you into the Ladies, no doubt.
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From:[info]cmcmck
Date:7th July, 2008 02:11 pm (UTC)
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*ROFL*

:oP

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From:[info]swordpanda
Date:7th July, 2008 11:34 am (UTC)
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Julie, Sylvia and I met up with swordpanda, who I hadn't seen in ages (and who is looking really good)

*blush*, why, thank you ... it was really nice to see you all too.

on the main matter, I have a friend who is involved with the ACPO (Assoc of Chief Police Officers) diversity team, and I believe the incident will also be addressed there (as well as internally within the Met).. so....yes, I think it will run....
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From:[info]julieisfree
Date:7th July, 2008 05:26 pm (UTC)
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*blush*, why, thank you



Tis simply the truth!
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From:[info]tartful_dodger
Date:7th July, 2008 11:52 am (UTC)
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I can't believe you were the first one to get there with that entry icon.

Damn you! :P
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From:[info]auntysarah
Date:7th July, 2008 05:51 pm (UTC)
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It's proven to be a most versatile icon!
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From:[info]tartful_dodger
Date:7th July, 2008 06:43 pm (UTC)
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Oops, I meant lj entry *title*.

I lose!
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From:[info]twiggy_j
Date:7th July, 2008 11:57 am (UTC)
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Rather unsettling
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From:[info]suzyscottdotcom
Date:7th July, 2008 12:39 pm (UTC)
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Very rarely do the police ever step in to catch the 'un-natural' things going on in the mens room at Green Park tube.

Staff there were (during my time at least) warned not to go in there!

These toilets were subject to numerous complaints, and gateline staff were only able to refer passengers to the owner of the toilets - London Borough of Westminster!
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From:[info]astras_brian
Date:7th July, 2008 01:36 pm (UTC)
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That officer is very experienced and well respected.

And so what? It doesn't matter how experienced and well respected someone may be. Nobody is perfect. I've seen very experienced and well respected people and leaders make deeply offensive statements and then try to spin things with weak excuses and intended placatories when challenged over their conduct.

It would be interesting to see the advice given to the LGBT LO officers and how that relates to the conduct Roz experienced.
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From:[info]nicollegurrl
Date:7th July, 2008 02:43 pm (UTC)
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"who suggested that transwomen should carry and be prepared to show a gender recognition certificate if we expected to be able to use public toilets."

I wonder how they could ask that from Transpeoples from outside the UK???,
as it does seem that a huge international city like Lonndon is expected
to have lots and lots of different nationalities?

Just wish I was there to join you peoples! :-)
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From:[info]scaryj
Date:7th July, 2008 06:44 pm (UTC)
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what a lot of turds. As for me if I was denied entry to a toilet I would simply inform them that the toilet would be right where I was. Do not get between a pregnant woman and the bog.
From:(Anonymous)
Date:20th July, 2008 05:04 pm (UTC)
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Is it actually true that pregnant women are allowed to commandeer policemens helmets to pee in?

I have heard this alleged, but it sounds rather crazy even for this country.
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From:[info]lost_angelwings
Date:7th July, 2008 10:34 pm (UTC)
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I have just spoken to the DCFD officer who is looking into this and all may not be what it seems.

The LO officer has given an account that differs from the one being circulated.

They sound like they're shocked that this was the case and OMG NOW WE NEED TO LOOK FOR TEH TRUTH.

I mean did they EXPECT him to own up to his transphobia!? He knows that it's gonna be his word against "a bunch of uppity trannies", of course he's gonna give a different version that makes him look like a real hero or something! >:O
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From:[info]aesmael
Date:20th July, 2008 12:44 pm (UTC)
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I am wondering what he could say that would someone make it right to have excluded her from the loo. The only thing which seems in dispute is the manner of its occurrence, not that it did.
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From:[info]hippieg2o
Date:7th July, 2008 11:36 pm (UTC)
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meeps who would have thought there could be so much made out of one person needing to go to the loo I think it just ridiculous that It even got to this why did the officer turn her away just because she was cis born great what next "Trannie" only underwear shops and beauticians oh wait thats Transformations opps my bad

but on a serious not I think its outrageous it really does bake my noodle that some one would do that to someone else it just really gets my heckles up
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From:[info]hippieg2o
Date:7th July, 2008 11:38 pm (UTC)
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Correction wasn't cis born
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From:[info]auntysarah
Date:7th July, 2008 11:39 pm (UTC)
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oh wait thats Transformations opps my bad

Well we are laydees, you know?
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From:[info]cmcmck
Date:8th July, 2008 07:38 am (UTC)
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We are?

Seesyalater :o)
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From:[info]mark_jones_jnr
Date:8th July, 2008 01:03 pm (UTC)
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The cheek of it.
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